Size of the primarchs - are you a fan?

[Karhedron]

Many IPs have “power creep” though. Like the original Superman could only jump over buildings, not fly. Maybe there’s a bit of that here, but Sanguinius taking down a bloodthirster is pretty old lore.

This is a good example. Sanguinius is supposed to have picked up the Blood Thirster and broken its back over his knee. That would be pretty much impossible if he was just Marine-sized or even a foot taller. Even at 12', picking up a current edition Blood Thirster would be amazing. Shorter than that and it becomes unbelievable.

 

Eventually Sanguinius was forced to retreat to within the palace itself, personally holding the Ultimate Gate against the oncoming horde while the last of his wounded men was carried through. Just as the giant ceramite gate was about to close, a Bloodthirster of Khorne leapt upon him and the daemon's huge talons closed around Sanguinius' throat. The Primarch took to the air, angel and daemon wrestling over the warring armies. Both sides halted for a moment to watch the titanic struggle. It was a conflict such as has been rarely seen; two beings of awesome power wrestling above them.

 

Sanguinius was weary and near the end of his strength, and the daemon gouged great wounds in his flesh. The heretical throng roared its approval as the Primarch was cast to the ground, the impact splintering the granite. For a moment the Primarch lay still and a groan rose from the Blood Angels as the daemon stood over him and howled in exultation. Then slowly and painfully the Blood Angels' Primarch rose and seized the creature, raised it high and broke its back across his knee. Then, with a halo of power playing round his head, he tossed its broken carcass back amid its followers. They beat their chests and rent their hair and wailed in dismay as the Ultimate Gate shut.

Edited September 13, 2021 by Karhedron

[LameBeard]

Yeah but Bloodthirsters didn’t used to be so big either!

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

At the end of the day complaining about Primarchs is like whining about Ronald McDonald for all the good it will do you…

[Karhedron]

At the end of the day complaining about Primarchs is like whining about Ronald McDonald for all the good it will do you…

 

The OP asked the question how people felt about the portrayed size of Primarchs. It isn't complaining, I think there has been good and valid debate on both sides.

Edited September 13, 2021 by Karhedron

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Some has been but not all IMO .

[techsoldaten]

The Primarch's are mythical creatures. Some if not all are able to change their size at will, or at least the perception of their size. They're enigmas wrapped in mystery with a dollop of misdirection and psychic influence on top

 

Nothing about them is certain!

 

I'm a fan of big Primarchs. Never sure what it meant, tho.

 

IIRC Primarchs were able to change their size at will. The question I've always had: is it because Primarchs literally change their size, or do Astartes perceive Primarchs differently based on their intent?

 

I could imagine a scenario where a genetically engineered superhuman commanding a legion of power armored warriors would benefit from being perceived as larger than life. But not all the time, just when he's leading from the front and needs to provide maximum inspiration.

 

In Talon of Horus, when Abaddon faces the clone of Horus, he feels an instinctual need to bow down and obey. This could extend to other aspects of how they interact.

[LameBeard]

One way I’ve rationalised the size issue in my head is that the primarchs’ growth is only completed by being reunited with the Emperor - like that is a kind of trigger for the final stage of their “becoming” - and no one on their adopted planets really recognised that their world-conquering was still as children. Even Angron is a child in those fighting pits - just a child bigger than all the adults around him.

[Karhedron]

IIRC Primarchs were able to change their size at will. The question I've always had: is it because Primarchs literally change their size, or do Astartes perceive Primarchs differently based on their intent?

I think in most cases it is an impression rather than a physical change. In one of the Dark Imperium books, Guilliman gets angry and his presence suddenly seems to fill the room.

 

The exception I think is Magnus who is actually described as physically changing in size. This makes sense as he is by far the most psychic of the Primarchs. It does raise questions about what happened to his wargear.

[Valkyrion]

I'll be honest, even though I've kinda vouched for the primarchs being 12 foot + in this very thread, I never actually picture their size when reading about them.

I've consciously made an effort this past week to read a short story or two about a primarch and try to imagine their size and it just doesn't compute. My mind just views primarchs as Kings or Lords and their gravitas and power is what gives them their size, not their size size, you know?

 

Magnus, when reading A Thousand Sons, feels absolute huge. Lorgar in the First Heretic seems tiny in comparison, and in the one or two scenes that both Magnus and Lorgar are in those respective books then that holds true still - Magnus feels huge and Lorgar feels tiny. But when Lorgar is with Argel Tal and the rest of the Word Bearers, he seems huge.

 

The writing of the primarchs, no matter the author, has made me feel like they are immense beings. The logistics of using the toilet or eating a curry or even more warlike things like sitting in a rhino or using a bolter hold no meaning for me. If they do to others then fair enough, there's room on the choom choom train for all of us. 

 

It's not official GW art, but this is one of my favourite pictures - I think I first saw it on ADB's blog after the first heretic came out and it kinda stuck with me;

 

If you forget the facts and figures of heights and weights and cubits then Cyrene is to Argel Tal what Argel Tal should be to Lorgar. 

[Marshal Rohr]

That photo is what a seven foot person looks like next to a girl that is 5’4, correct. Maybe there just aren’t many big people in Europe but some of you are severely overestimating what a problem it would be for a Primarch to be that big.

[Valkyrion]

That photo is what a seven foot person looks like next to a girl that is 5’4, correct. Maybe there just aren’t many big people in Europe but some of you are severely overestimating what a problem it would be for a Primarch to be that big.

 

 

Not overestimating anything, just placing minimal importance on it. The idea of the primarchs being big is better than the reality of them being big, but we're not talking knitting circles and cookery classes, no matter how hilarious that would be. It's whether it ruins the immersion for the reader or not. To me it doesn't, because you have the mortal to astartes scale, and then you have the astartes to primarch scale. Whatever that scale is, to my mind, is irrelevant. It's what the scale represents. 

 

If you can't get along with Sanguinius eating an apple then I get it, I really do, I just disagree with the importance placed upon it. 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

That picture of Cyrene and Argel is super fanboi as it gets. He was an absolute monster with no redeeming values. Funny how daemon princes get a free pass.

[Karhedron]

If you can't get along with Sanguinius eating an apple then I get it, I really do, I just disagree with the importance placed upon it.

To be honest, the line in the same scene having him sniggering (like a naughty schoolgirl) was more immersion breaking for me than the apple.

 

But it does make a point that what bothers some people in prose will not necessarily be what bothers other people.