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Who outranks whom?


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7 replies to this topic

#1
Vulshra

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What is the command structure of the inner circle? Are Masters or Interrogator Chaplains superior in the hunt for the fallen? does it depend on company?

 

e.g.,

 

A successor chapter master of the Ravenwing (so not a grand master) believes that if they strike quickly they can capture a member of the fallen. An interrogator chaplain of a successor disagrees and orders a delay until they can arrive with deathwing reinforcements. Is the Ravenwing obligated to stand down?

 


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#2
Grotsmasha

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As best I understand, a person's military rank and position within the Chapter aren't necessarily analogous to their level within the Inner Circle.

In the above example, the Ravenwing Master would still have command, if the decision was made on the battlefield. If the decision is being made beforehand in a conclave, then it is possible the Interrogator Chaplain might have the rank

Another thing to keep in mind is that the Dark Angels (and presumably their Successors) have key words / phrases encoded into their indoctrination process, allowing for suggestive / hypnotical mind control. There's a BL novel where (IIRC) Asmodai uses it on Belial.

Edited by Grotsmasha, 23 September 2021 - 02:17 AM.

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#3
Chaplain Lucifer

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In a military operation the commander calls the shots. The Chaplain is an advisor. He may have higher inner circle ranking but he can't override commanders orders.
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#4
EnsignJoker

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I imagine it’s analogous to a government agent attached to a military unit. The agent will be there for support and logistics and at the command of the ranking military member, but if there’s something related to why the agent is there then he will have authority to do what needs to be done with the assets he’s around.

Even for Ravenwing, IIRC, their inner circle is different from Deathwing inner circle; they don’t really know WHY they’re looking for what they’re looking for, only that they are. A Ravenwing commander might know enough to call in the Deathwing element, at which point the ranking Deathwing commander would most likely call any shot needed for the mission.

A company master is interesting. I believe they’re all inner circle(?) but I don’t think they know as much as a Deathwing member, unless they’ve previously served in that company. If that’s the case I imagine they’re all indoctrinated or know enough to stay out of the DWs way if a fallen is detected.

Just a couple off top of head thoughts anyways. Good topic 👍

#5
march10k

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It depends on the context of the disagreement.  I prefer to go with the idea that more of the host/order structure survives than simply the Deathwing and the Ravenwing.  If so, are the two leaders members of the same host and/or order?  Which of the three available organizational structures is the most appropriate context in which to settle the dispute?  Perhaps one of the two might win out based on precedence in the overt command structure, but the other might have special knowledge based on adherence to an order whose raison d'être pertains very closely to the matter at hand.  How can he apply that special knowledge to ensure the correct decision is made without violating oaths of secrecy?  It's hard being of the First Legion!


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#6
Vulshra

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Interesting perspectives all.

To help frame the question, we do know that inner circle position and chapter rank, at least to those outside the inner circle, are different: talon masters are generally NOT inner circle but nominally outrank black knights, though the latter are higher within the chapter

#7
Grotsmasha

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A more interesting question is, can a ranking member of the Inner Circle from one chapter, command another member, from another chapter? For example If the Consecrators have military control of a crusade / multiple chapter mission, could a Chief Librarian / Chaplain of the Angels of Absolution over-rule a Consecrator Company Master?


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#8
Vulshra

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We know they can, at least when in hunt for the fallen. per codex, when multiple unforgiven chapters coordinate in a hunt, the highest ranking member of the inner circle automatically takes over regardless of chapter affiliation




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