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Exemplary Battles - The Battle of Calth: Underworld War

Joe

By Joe
in + WARHAMMER: THE HORUS HERESY +

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WrathOfTheLion Venerable Brother

WrathOfTheLion

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Nice that this time the Ultramarines get a unit. Hopefully we'll see a bit more loyalist Legions get featured later on now that they've finally made that happen for them.

 

Will have to look at playing this one. One of my friends plays Ultramarines and I have my Word Bearers, so should be fun.

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SkimaskMohawk Venerable Brother

SkimaskMohawk

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These make a mockery of the banestrike rounds. That being said, they're still basically a glorified tac support squad; missing the extra attack really makes these guys stay in the ranged role as opposed to traditional destroyers that can be flexed for either.
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Excessus Venerable Brother

Excessus

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...
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lansalt Battle-Brother

lansalt

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

It's weird that this unit is closer to proto plague marines than the featured DG destroyers

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Vazzy Veteran

Vazzy

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

Man, have you seen the Ultramrines LA rules? As someone who has played them since release, they have arguably one of the crappiest legion rules, and this unit doesn’t play into the few strengths Ultras have anyways. If you’d said Imperial Fists I’d certainly agree but it’s clear no one in the studio has UM as their favorites

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Commander Dawnstar Venerable Brother

Commander Dawnstar

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

 

Well they also stole the Fulmentarus Terminator idea from the Iron Warriors' Tyrants, so it wouldn't be the first time...

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SkimaskMohawk Venerable Brother

SkimaskMohawk

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

 

Well they also stole the Fulmentarus Terminator idea from the Iron Warriors' Tyrants, so it wouldn't be the first time...

 

 

Yea ultramarines are known for stealing other legions' ideas and having strong special units. But that's balanced by having a terrible special rule, terrible rites, and terrible characters outside the primarch.

 

Unlike what excessus claims, they're rather terrible with all things considered. Ironically, the alpha legion are one of the absolute best legions, as their only weakness is special units, which Coils fixes and allows them the most choice out of any legion as a result.

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Vazzy Veteran

Vazzy

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

Well they also stole the Fulmentarus Terminator idea from the Iron Warriors' Tyrants, so it wouldn't be the first time...

Yea ultramarines are known for stealing other legions' ideas and having strong special units. But that's balanced by having a terrible special rule, terrible rites, and terrible characters outside the primarch.

 

Unlike what excessus claims, they're rather terrible with all things considered. Ironically, the alpha legion are one of the absolute best legions, as their only weakness is special units, which Coils fixes and allows them the most choice out of any legion as a result.

 

Definitely. As someone who plays Ultras and AL, I can safely say that one legion is much much better than the other. UM lists have to work against the rules, AL get elevated by them.

 

Anyone who has played 30k consistently can attest to how good DG and AL are.

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SkimaskMohawk Venerable Brother

SkimaskMohawk

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Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

Well they also stole the Fulmentarus Terminator idea from the Iron Warriors' Tyrants, so it wouldn't be the first time...

Yea ultramarines are known for stealing other legions' ideas and having strong special units. But that's balanced by having a terrible special rule, terrible rites, and terrible characters outside the primarch.

 

Unlike what excessus claims, they're rather terrible with all things considered. Ironically, the alpha legion are one of the absolute best legions, as their only weakness is special units, which Coils fixes and allows them the most choice out of any legion as a result.

 

Definitely. As someone who plays Ultras and AL, I can safely say that one legion is much much better than the other. UM lists have to work against the rules, AL get elevated by them.

 

Anyone who has played 30k consistently can attest to how good DG and AL are.

 

 

uhhhhhh.... agree with everything but the death guard lol. They're right down there at the bottom with the ultramarines imo.  

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Lord Marshal Veteran

Lord Marshal

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uhhhhhh.... agree with everything but the death guard lol. They're right down there at the bottom with the ultramarines imo.  

 

 

Hard disagree there. They're definitely not S-Tier, but they're a solid B. Immune to Fear/Pinning, Dangerous Terrain rerolls and 4+ FNP to Phospex is pretty good.

 

The bigger problem in my opinion is that despite The Reaping being themed about attritional foot sloggers, almost everybody - even fluff lovers - ends up cramming their infantry into Rhinos and Spartans to get around the lack of Run.

 

Creeping Death RoW is utter trash though, I'll give you that.

Edited by Lord Marshal
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Astartes Consul Venerable Brother

Astartes Consul

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Love the unit and think the rules are nicely balanced, as most of the Exemplary Battles series so far has been. Fluffy, with a tabletop niche that makes them worth taking but not super expensive. Nice to see that points wise they're the same as 10 Legion Destroyers before any upgrades. Feel like the Death Guard unit last month missed a trick by being more expensive than a standard Tactical Support Squad with Chem Munitions.

 

Outside of ZM or Centurion, imagine they'll need a Rhino at least to give them the mobility & ability to get in 18" range for those sweet Bolters and Suspensor Web Missile Launchers. Shame they can't have a Termite as a dedicated transport though.

 

 

 

 

Obviously the ultramarines developed better chem munitions than the DG and made a unit more efficient at killing marines than an AL headhunter squad. Grats to the UM players but it reeks of favoritism...

 

Well they also stole the Fulmentarus Terminator idea from the Iron Warriors' Tyrants, so it wouldn't be the first time...

 

 

Yea ultramarines are known for stealing other legions' ideas and having strong special units. But that's balanced by having a terrible special rule, terrible rites, and terrible characters outside the primarch.

 

Unlike what excessus claims, they're rather terrible with all things considered. Ironically, the alpha legion are one of the absolute best legions, as their only weakness is special units, which Coils fixes and allows them the most choice out of any legion as a result.

 

 

Much as I know we deserve it for the years/decades of 40k favouritism, when I look at our  30k rules and characters, then compare them to most of the other legions I just...sigh

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StrangerOrders Battle-Brother

StrangerOrders

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I would personally (as someone that cares more about models than rules) say that its laughable to say the UM are favored when they only have models for a single special unit and have only recently been lucky enough to get HQs.

 

Dont get me wrong, the IW are still (I believe) the mosy shafted Legion for models. But the UM are fairly shafted.

 

In terms of favoritism, I'd personally give Imperial Fists and Word Bearers some real side-eye...

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SkimaskMohawk Venerable Brother

SkimaskMohawk

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Posted (edited)

 

 

 

uhhhhhh.... agree with everything but the death guard lol. They're right down there at the bottom with the ultramarines imo.

 

Hard disagree there. They're definitely not S-Tier, but they're a solid B. Immune to Fear/Pinning, Dangerous Terrain rerolls and 4+ FNP to Phospex is pretty good.

 

The bigger problem in my opinion is that despite The Reaping being themed about attritional foot sloggers, almost everybody - even fluff lovers - ends up cramming their infantry into Rhinos and Spartans to get around the lack of Run.

 

Creeping Death RoW is utter trash though, I'll give you that.

Pinning basically doesn't exist like it used to; barrage and snipers used to provide it by default. I'm honestly not too sure what else commonly causes it, maybe just disembarking from destroyed vehicles? Ignore fear can be more useful. Night lords are very strong and like it, as do daemons. mechanicum bots also give it out. That's like...3 matchups out of 23? Oh I guess knights, if you consider that an actual army. Both are rather fringe benefits.

 

Dangerous terrain also got changed like pinning; it used to ignore armour, but now it doesn't. There's a 5% chance to lose a power armour model from dangerous. And you need to have dangerous terrain to start.

 

4+ against phosphex can be immense. I personally got really bored of phosphex spam back in 2016, but I know a lot of people still love to put it in their list. Still kind of dependant on your opponent though, which is the problem with all of them. There's a good chance you're just left with no positive legion trait.

 

Reaping compounds it by being terrible. Not being able to run, flat out, or deepstrike is a really, really harsh requirement to get move through cover, which is basically replicable with dozer blades on vehicles anyways. Oh and 1 fast attack choice (rip javelins). I don't think hss as non compulsory troops is worth anything either; they're very vulnerable to barrage and making them scoring only invites more focus. It also asks you to have used your heavy support slots to make the swap really worth it. You can just run pride and basically make the same list, but better. And not get locked into your dz by just parking infront of you, trucker style.

 

@stranger orders iron warriors have all their special units currently. None of their special characters though.

Edited by SkimaskMohawk
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StrangerOrders Battle-Brother

StrangerOrders

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Posted (edited)

 

 

uhhhhhh.... agree with everything but the death guard lol. They're right down there at the bottom with the ultramarines imo.

 

Hard disagree there. They're definitely not S-Tier, but they're a solid B. Immune to Fear/Pinning, Dangerous Terrain rerolls and 4+ FNP to Phospex is pretty good.

The bigger problem in my opinion is that despite The Reaping being themed about attritional foot sloggers, almost everybody - even fluff lovers - ends up cramming their infantry into Rhinos and Spartans to get around the lack of Run.

Creeping Death RoW is utter trash though, I'll give you that.

Pinning basically doesn't exist like it used to; barrage and snipers used to provide it by default. I'm honestly not too sure what else commonly causes it, maybe just disembarking from destroyed vehicles? Ignore fear can be more useful. Night lords are very strong and like it, as do daemons. mechanicum bots also give it out. That's like...3 matchups out of 23? Oh I guess knights, if you consider that an actual army. Both are rather fringe benefits.

Dangerous terrain also got changed like pinning; it used to ignore armour, but now it doesn't. There's a 5% chance to lose a power armour model from dangerous. And you need to have dangerous terrain to start.

4+ against phosphex can be immense. I personally got really bored of phosphex spam back in 2016, but I know a lot of people still love to put it in their list. Still kind of dependant on your opponent though, which is the problem with all of them. There's a good chance you're just left with no positive legion trait.

Reaping compounds it by being terrible. Not being able to run, flat out, or deepstrike is a really, really harsh requirement to get move through cover, which is basically replicable with dozer blades on vehicles anyways. Oh and 1 fast attack choice (rip javelins). I don't think hss as non compulsory troops is worth anything either; they're very vulnerable to barrage and making them scoring only invites more focus. It also asks you to have used your heavy support slots to make the swap really worth it. You can just run pride and basically make the same list, but better. And not get locked into your dz by just parking infront of you, trucker style.

@stranger orders iron warriors have all their special units currently. None of their special characters though.

Well you can proxy Iron Havocs I guess... but I personally like proper sculpts you know?

 

I despise this whole 'stick a head on it' thing... I want my sculpted detail lol. Compare Iconoclasts to Destroyers and tell me it isnt comparing a guilded palonquin to a damned volkswagon!

 

I am still salty that they stopped selling so many customized bits. I'm not keen on sailing but you basically have no choice if you crave flavor.

 

But yeah, I forgot Iron Circle existed lol.

Edited by StrangerOrders
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Arendious Veteran

Arendious

Posted
Posted

man, i wish my AL headhunters had this nemesis ammo rule :F

I hold out, an admittedly slim, hope that when we get our Hydra-specific Destroyer rules they unlock something like this.

 

Otherwise...

Look at me, now look at your Stormbird. Now back to me, then back to your Stormbird.

 

What's that in the hold?

That's right, the Rewards of Treachery.

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