Reclusiarch Darius

Flyer spam is lame and yeah an army that has better ground coverage will quickly screen you out of viable flight paths. DA probably work better pure tbh. GK want a lot of points, they chew through nearly 1k pretty fast with the basics.

Yeah I was thinking that would probably be necessary. I think I'll stick with my original plan of just spamming Venerables for on-table drops.

Well then you're kinda wasting the power. He's more accurate than the Razorback, plus has more shots that will receive the bonus (due to two gun arms). Speaking of which, have people run quad autocannon on the Venerable before? I'm getting pretty tired of watching my D6 damage become 1's or getting saved. It's only a -1 to enemy saves, but 3+ invul is a thing in multiple armies these days anyway. I'm not likely to crack a tank line at range anyway, so I don't mind too much dropping off against T8 targets. Is it still worth keeping one twin las arm? Another option for supporting alpha strike is an Interceptor Outrider detachment. Lets you have more on-table drops, that can Shunt Turn 1 and form part of the alpha anyway. Does leave them vulnerable to Turn 1 enemy shooting, but it's the same issue the Dreads have. Has anyone had success with Interceptors used like that?

In general you should take powers that will be self-cast. You could conceivably park a Purgator squad nearby as an 'Astral Aim' source, but that just worsens the comparison with the Venerable.

Yeah I should have used Truesilver on my Grandmaster, as he died mostly in the Psychic Phase :( Our Venerable Dreads are pretty good IMO. Still somewhat overpriced, but they at least do what they're supposed to and losing one isn't GG.

Agreed about first turn being clutch. Especially if you whiff it, it pretty much overshadows the rest of the game. Like I said, for now I'm playing 'as is' 40k. But once all the armies come out and we've been through another FAQ cycle, I am strongly considering house rules to tweak the core rules. When do I have 80 points spare in the most expensive army in the game, barring Custodes? Assuming you aren't taking total jank, bare minimum you're looking at 800 points for a core Battalion (double GMDK and three Strikes squads, one of which you probably want to run 10-man to use 'Psybolt' on). After that, sprinkle in the near-mandatory Venerable Dreads for fire support, some Purgators...and I'm out of points. Rhinos are garbage, no Marine player uses them. Same for Razorbacks post-FAQ nerf. Same for drop pods, which are actually substantially better than both but are still overpriced. Point costs matter. I'm not wasting points on garbage that dies Turn 1 with no effect. 'Wisdom' is okay maybe Turn 1, but yeah normally I'm out of Command Points by bottom of Turn 1. Razorback can't 'Astral Aim', and if you have to reposition to get Line of Sight or you're shooting -1 to hit targets, they quickly drop off in effectiveness. Venerables still hit on 3's in those situations, and they're pumping out a krak missile as well for about a third more. I'd never take las Razors at their current price. I actually think Venerables are overcosted anyway, but they're just reliable anti-tank we can't get elsewhere. I have been considering Scions, however it is a little tricky because they also want to drop in Turn 1 from Reserve. So you'd probably need to spend points on some Taurox or other Guard stuff to be on-table drops. I have been on the receiving end of the suicide melta/plasma and Prime combo, it's brutal. Yeah I'm actually drafting my house rules now for my club. One of those is removing Psychic Focus, and imposing the Beta Smite '+1 to each subsequent cast of same power' penalty to everything, including Smite. It kills the Smite cheese, and opens the door for cooler tactics we currently can't perform. However, I'm not familiar with Eldar or Chaos, so allowing multi-casting of some of their powers might get out of hand. 'Vortex' however is the only one I'd restrict on us, probably just for HQ units (as its advanced magick).

Open Play and Narrative Play are ignored by the entire community. I'd simply never get games. Also I personally have no interest in them. All that costs points, which we simply don't have. Also, Rhinos/Razorbacks die quite easily to enemy anti-tank. Turn 2 charges won't happen because they will de-mech you Turn 1 (any army that can't dismantle Rhinos at range is bad). If you even make it into a Guard tank line, they are simply a terrible player and deserve the loss. Allies offer cheaper drops and more Command Points, which is another thing all those points sunk in vehicles doesn't do. Razorbacks biggest issue IMO (besides cost, which is stupid high) is they hit on 4's if you move. It's something I'm considering for my house rules, granting Relentless back to all the platforms that had it in 7th (namely vehicles and monsters keyword). With the amount of -1 to hit in the game, it's hardly backbreaking to allow those platforms to work properly. I'm still considering what to do for Russes and Machine Spirit Marine vehicles (might let them +1 to hit, LR's need a buff anyway they're pure garbage). Yeah it's something I've considered. I'm probably gonna do a Patrol though, as I have written off 'Psychic Onslaught' and 'Psybolt Ammo' as useable, so Command Points don't matter as much for me. I only really want the TDA Librarian for 'Null Zone' (GK fall apart against decent invul saves), everything else is gravy. Rolling off for first turn is fine by me. I actually found the 'cheese your drops so you go first' dumb. +1 to the roll is fine, as GK you will usually get the bonus anyway (my army is 10 drops, not many lists go that low). The real kicker is that only half our army can be Teleport Striking in. If they removed that restriction, we'd work a lot better.

Yeah I got the impression pure Custodes have similar issues to us, but they at least bring the pain. It is somewhat depressing that my big alpha punch is mostly S4 spam :( it just feels like 7th in that regard. I'm gonna get some autocannon arms and test out my Venerables with them while I wait for Armigers to come along. My other thought was swapping out for Doomglaives, as they're cheaper.

Yeah I'm pretty concerned about how to deal with the Exocrine+Hive Guard gunline. Melee is impossible without Fly, and even then they can deny landing space with good placement. Hive Guard also don't require Line of Sight, so they can be hidden all game potentially and you can't avoid their firepower if they are in range. GK lack fast or cheap chaff to tie stuff up in melee. Currently (assuming I do integrate Armigers into my list), my plan is to massacre the Exocrines first, then take out the Hive Guard after. I'm gonna be taking three of them, so I expect one will get into melee with the Hive Guard and blender them. Thermal lances look solid for anti-tank/monster requirements, even with the Malanthrope -1 aura. How are you finding Custodes+GK btw GML? I would have expected (besides the Biker Captains) that our issues get a bit exacerbated. But it sounds like they go together pretty well.

Paladins are fine, but their biggest issue is their slowness (it's a general TDA problem actually) and they're entirely reliant on melee to do work. I've stopped using mine entirely because they don't accomplish much in a typical game. I've been tossing up running double Battalion and just starting some of the Strikes on table. They're gonna die either way, but 105 points for 5 dudes isn't amazingly expensive. Currently I use Purgators for a backfield drop to deny landing zones, and they've been working fine. However they are kinda inefficient and slow. I often feel like more Strikes would do most of the same job, be cheaper and count towards another Battalion. The biggest obstacle is the two additional HQ's we need, which is really points hungry (none of them are below 130 points except for Brotherhood Champion, who doesn't do anything). I've also been considering doing house rules to get around some of the dumber aspects of Matched Play. I personally have no issue with null deploy for other armies, and for GK it's our entire playstyle. However, acceptance of ignoring Matched Play restrictions is difficult because they're core rules. I am also trying to figure out the alternative to 'Psychic Focus' as well. Until GW decides to let us play the army as intended, we need on table drops. That means Allies or taking subpar stuff to fill out DZ with (or wasting Teleport Strike on Strikes). Razorbacks could work potentially, but I need to playtest that (also they don't add any additional Command Points, which is another of our glaring issues, we typically run out Turn 1/2).

Yeah I commonly leave my Brother-Captain on table to deny enemy landing spots, then 'Gate' him into my alpha strike. My typical composition means I have 5 Teleport Strike slots and five on-table drops (it's kinda hard to get more than that without taking subpar stuff). 'Gate' basically lets you sneak another unit into your alpha.

Here is the problem with delaying. Horde armies will just daisy chain their dudes across as much space as possible. It's actually possible to deny the entire mid-field and DZ if your opponent spreads well. I've had cases where by Turn 1 second player, the first player has already spread past their DZ limit and corralled them into the third of the board they want their opponent to land in. As GML mentions, storm bolters work best at 12", and you can easily land them in range Turn 1. Clearing chaff screens is important for opening up charge lanes. They will go down to massed fire. I don't even bother trying to charge Turn 1 anymore, people are very switched on about screening these days.

Yeah we had real trouble figuring it out. I checked the FAQ's and we agreed to it being 'two dice pick highest' when both our strats are used. Has there been an official ruling we can reference next time? The Kronos Warlord trait is pretty good in and of itself, also fluffy cos it was his actual force. He's not a big tournament guy, but he has been tweaking his list a lot in 8th. Yeah I agree, they're extremely good. Lots of redundancy, very good shooting, their psychic is quite solid as well (especially defensively). I think it may be due to the cheese builds that lock most people out of the top tables. Nids have strong armies, but nothing cheesy in my opinion. It was extra depressing because they literally did 2 wounds with shooting between them, and that psycannon round was from the one I didn't buff with 'Psychic Onslaught' :( Quite well actually. For a cheap backfield drop, they're fine. They prevented any attempt by his Gaunts to advance on my objective, and even helped bring down a Flyrant (the D3 damage is good when you sneak some wounds past enemy saves). I'll probably keep using my two squads. I am retiring the Venerables for Armigers ASAP though.

So, had a game against one of the club regulars. He's been playing Tyranids since forever, and by pure happenstance painted his entire army in Kronos colours way back in 7th. Needless to say, he's pretty happy with the new codex. My list: Battalion: - GMDK w/greatsword, heavy psycannon, gatling psilencer, 'Sanctuary', Warlord (First Into The Fray), teleporter - GMDK w/greatsword, heavy psycannon, gatling psilencer, 'Gate', teleporter - 10x Strikes w/falchions, 'Hammerhand' - 5x Strikes w/falchions, 'Vortex' - 5x Strikes w/falchions, 'Hammerhand' - (2) Justicar w/falchions, 4x Purgators w/psilencer, 'Astral Aim' Vanguard: - Brother-Captain w/relic hammer, 'Gate' - Doomglaive - 2x Venerable Dreadnought w/twin lascannon, missile launcher His list (roughly) Battalion: - Flyrant w/twin heavy devourers, rending claws, Paroxysm+Catalyst, Warlord (Soul Hunger) - 2x Flyrant w/twin heavy devourers, rending claws (one had Psychic Scream I think, didn't matter much) - Malanthrope - 5x Zoanthropes w/Psychic Scream - 6x Hive Guard - 2x Exocrine - (3) 15x Gaunts w/fleshborers (roughly, one of them might have been 10) - 3x Biovores - Big pod (transport for Zoeys) Mission was one objective worth 3VP each, placed in our DZ Deployment was Dawn of War, I made him commit to the left side first (as I had less drops) and then deployed my on-table stuff on the right flank (around my objective). Slay the Warlord, First Blood and Linebreaker were in effect. I won roll off for Turn 1, he failed to Seize. Turn 1 GK: One Venerable has line of sight to Biovores, other one is safely behind a big hill so I opt to go for 'Astral Aim'. Purgators, Brother-Captain and Doomglaive spread a bit more to deny more landing space (as nothing is in range for them). Alpha comes down, daisy-chaining the GMDK's between the Strikes to ensure everyone has re-rolls. I'm concentrated on the left flank, trying to blow through the screening Gaunts so I have charge lanes on the Exocrines. Psychic phase is meh, I fail 'Vortex' and 'Sanctuary' (the latter due to his 'one dice to cast' strat, which I'm forced to use my other strat to push to 'two dice pick highest'). I burn all but two Command Points putting out 'Heed' on my Warlord (so he's at least on a 3+ against the Exocrine fire), and turning on 'Psychic Onslaught'. Brother-Captain successfully 'Gates' himself into position to help the Smite range go up at least. Shooting is hilariously bad, I do 2 damage to a single Exocrine and massacre one Gaunt screen with storm bolter (they also tanked all my Smite). The Venerables kill one Biovore between them (I think I rolled triple 1's to wound with one of them). Malanthrope is such value, it honestly denied so many 3's to hit. Turn 1 Kronos Nids: His alpha lands behind me (I successfully blocked him out of anywhere near my objective at least). Exocrines, Hive Guard and Smite kill both Grandmasters...I use 'Only In Death' and kill one Zoey. He tries to snipe the Brother-Captain, but I deny the one Smite that goes his way, and pass the saves from devourers. Gaunts on right flank cautiously advance, trying to stay out of range of the Purgators that keep moving up. Turn 2 GK: At this point I'm playing to draw, because I have no way to get onto his objective with so many gunbeasts in the way. I turn around and move in on the Flyrants and Zoanthrope brood. 'Vortex' fails again, Soul Hunger triggers and eats 3/5 of the squad. 'Hammerhand' goes off on the 10-man Strike squad at least. Shooting goes amazingly well for a change, I down two Flyrants with the Venerables+left side Purgator squad, plus Doomglaive helps as well. Warlord Flyrant takes a few wounds from shooting. Charges go really well, I get the Brother-Captain and a couple of falchions hitting the Warlord Flyrant, while the 10-man unit dogpiles the rest of their attacks into the Zoey brood. Melee doesn't go quite as well, I do nothing except 2 damage to one Zoey. In return, Flyrant puts the Brother-Captain down to 2 wounds. Turn 2 Kronos Nids: Warlord Flyrant backs out of combat, flying over the melee to get a snipe on the Brother-Captain. Zoey's back out of combat to do the same. Shooting and Smite clears away all the Strikes and the Brother-Captain...Doomglaive eats some Hive Guard shots and is put down to five wounds. Turn 3 GK: Doomglaive advances, looking to charge the Zoeys if he can (turns out he's 13" away still after moving so no dice). Purgators on right flank shift up into a ruined building to whittle away at some Gaunts. Shooting is mediocre, I kill one more Zoey and a handful of Gaunts. Turn 4 Kronos Nids: He moves up Flyrant to annihilate my left side Purgator squad, which he does. Hive Guard beat Doomglaive. Turn 4 GK: Left-flank Purgators hold their ground and keep whittling away at Gaunts. Venerables take aim and kill Warlord Flyrant, bringing us to a draw on points. Turn 4 Kronos Nids: Biovores kill two Purgators, and the Hive Guard eat one of the Venerables. Turn 5 GK: Venerable does nothing (whiffed all my rolls), Purgators kill a few Gaunts I think. Turn 5 Kronos Nids: Last Venerable is still mostly screened by terrain/out of range of Hive Guard, so he survives but his Purgator brothers die horribly. We roll for a game end and don't get a Turn 6. 5VP each draw (as we both got Warlord, he had Linebreaker and I had First Blood, and neither objective was taken by opponent). Such a brutal game, and I had some truly abysmal rolls. I am strongly considering ditching all the guns off Grandmasters, they're kinda useless most of the time to be honest. I am also changing out the Purgators and Doomglaive for my four Venerable build. I was severely lacking the multi-damage output necessary to kill the gunbeasts, and they remained safe from melee all game (or shot anything that came into charge range down). I hate D6 damage rolls though, they can just fail horribly sometimes. Kronos is definitely the best fleet. The anti-psyker Warlord trait and strategem just shut me down a lot, 'Shadow' cancels the Brotherhood bonus for casting (although not for Denying I believe). Exocrines are disgusting, hitting on 3's firing twice and re-rolling 1's to hit if they stay still. Hive Guard kept getting a 'fire twice' strat applied to them, which made them insane value.

Yeah I've kinda grown weary of ADB's shtick by now. He overuses the formula to the point that it's expected now. Which quickly turns me off later novels, because I start to see almost the exact same dialogue (and he does repeat scenarios/characters). I'll still read his stuff, but he seriously needs to break out of it. It's just lazy writing basically. It irritates me especially because despite (rather than because) of the formula, he does show flashes of genius (like giving Sigismund a worthy death etc). He is one of the most inventive writers at BL, he kinda needs to be made to write out of his comfort zone though. Kyme is just dull. His work isn't even terrible, its just flat and mediocre. All of the aspects that make Salamanders interesting are never explored properly, and instead I hear 'anvil', 'fire' and 'hammer' about a billion times. There are some moments of insight into Vulkan's unique perspective (he's the humanitarian of his brothers), but it gets lost in oceans of cringe or tedium. 'Old Earth' is boring and pointless, just in case anyone thinks because they're in the webway it has any impact on the Siege. I agree with people praising 'Fulgrim', I liked it a lot. I'm not a fan of Emperor's Children, but the more novels I read about them, the more they grow on me. They're still arrogant peacocks, but the 30k series has fleshed them out properly (especially Fabius). 'Palatine Phoenix' was surprisingly good, despite the cheesy premise (Fulgrim decides to prove a point and conquer a world with a command squad). Iron Hands remain boring and no one seems to be able to write them intelligently, by comparison (for me at least). I agree Thorpe is overrated, but you can't accuse him of being boring (which is Kyme's problem). I think I'm an outlier in that I actually like the 30k Dark Angels novels, although I agree 'Descent' is a slog at times.