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Escalation league;Weeks 3+4; 1250 pt. "A knight to remember"

Tyranid Tau Escalation VASSAL Competition

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#1
Emperors Immortals

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Hello guardsmen,

A quick report of my first battle of 7th and the first in an escalation VASSAL league im in.


We got purge the alien and vanguard, he was Tau and brought this list;

Shadowsun
2x 12 firewarrios w/shas'sui
4 pathfinders
double missile broadside


I took

CCS w/ 2 GL
IP, 2 GL in PCS, flamer in each IS
Vets, carapce, 2 melta and a taurox
LR eradicator w/ HF


First turn, he killed 3 of the CCS, blew up the taurox and killed 2 vets.

I took out half a squad of firewarriors with a good Eradicator shot, and ordered Vets to "Bring it Down" on Shadowsun, which I did as she had jumped within 6" of 2 meltas and 7 rapid firing lasguns - which killed her!!!! he was upset and I felt very lucky.

I had rolled the extra command trait, so I also orderd FRF,SRF on the combined guard infantry squad to kill the pathfinder squad (who were infiltrated very near my table half)


Second turn, he fires the broadside at the remaining CCS, missing with everything. His firewarriors move into a ruin in the centre.
I sweep around with the infantry blob, FRF,SRF it and kill them all (very lucky I felt). Move the vets forward and kill teh braodside with a eradicator shell - he had thought he got cover saves hehehe.

He condeded at this point with only a squad of firewarriors in the building in the centre left.

Solid victory. I feel I got very lucky but also took advantage of the few mistakes he had made.

Hope to repeat this, next round gets another 250 pts, id like to add a Demolisher and either

a 2nd CCS for more orders and redundancy w/HF to back up teh IP
a vet squad with carapce and mortar for objective sitting
OR primaris psyker and priest for the IP

What do you think woudl mesh best with the list and any tips for strategy?


Edited by emperors immortals, 18 July 2014 - 11:13 AM.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#2
Kontakt

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An excellent example of how one shooting army can completely bowl over another. Guard can simply put so many men on the table that their enemies cannot possibly kill them all. In my local meta, guard use multiple squads instead of the one big squad in order to avoid losing large sums of firepower to assault. Also, its pretty common to find a regimental standard in the CCS to prevent the squads from running.



#3
hendrik

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instead of that veteran squad with a mortar, how about a wyvern? it will EAT his tau infantry!

for exactly 250 pts you could add:

-leman russ demolisher, camo netting, heavy flamer sponsons, hull mounted heavy flamer

-wyvern

 

now i know that the demolisher will likely never use those flamer sponsons, but you just think what happens when that demolisher outflanks (due to the warlord trait) and burns up anything too close to risk the demolisher shot on (or deepstriking meltasuits!)



WAR WITHIN, WAR WITHOUT!!

#4
Emperors Immortals

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Thanks guys!

Hmm, Hendrik that is a good idea - im loving the LR tanks and it would come in handy if i got the outflank, and cant believe I forgot teh Wyvern when the original idea was for 3 wyvern and some unit upgrades.

Kontakt the standard is a good idea - it was just lucky rolls that held my army otgether really. I mobbed my units together to absorb enemy fire and not break - the plan was to pin him down with the guns and break him with the CC, it kind of worked and was aweseom fun!

So ill think about what to do next, also any other tips are greatly appreciated :D

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#5
Idlem

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You used "Bring it Down!" on Shadowsun? Tank/Monster Hunter doesn't apply to her. Did you mean another order instead?

 

A demolisher will be handy for your next round. I bet with another 250 you may see an enemy tank in there or a Riptide.


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#6
Emperors Immortals

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Sorry, i meant "Fire on my Target" - which was amazing!

We play on fairly well terrained tables, so teh demolisher is definatly going in!

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#7
WarriorFish

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Great news, well done on your glorious victory! May it be the first of many :) That'll show those upstart xenos, the Eradicator proves its worth once more :D You can leave most of his infantry to it and focus your points elsewhere - but keep in mind he will likely be gunning for it now. I think you'll need more numbers as that's one of our main strengths - more troopers also means more guns!


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#8
Emperors Immortals

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Thanks WarriorFish!

Im hoping to learn the mysterious art of Infantry Application - im used to low model count marine armies so its pretty cool to see so many dudes!

Tips on synchronising with armoured elements are appreciated :D

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#9
Vash

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Well the battle sounds like it went all wrong for the Tau Empire player. First of all I don't know what Shadowsun was doing so close to your army unsupported. She needs to be at a safe distance at all times. Sure the Erradicator tank is a threat, but that threat has to be dealt with caution. 

 

If your opponent brings a Riptide, you really need to look out, unless he makes blunders like he did this time. The Riptide can take a punch, and give one back with no mercy. But the Riptide in general needs markerlight support. 

Another potential up comer is a Hammerhead to knock out your tanks. With submunition upgrade it can be a huge threat to your infantry too. Worst part is that he can include two of them in 250 pts. 

 

Also do remember that Tau Empire get stronger and stronger once you increase the points of the game. This due to that they can start getting better synergy between their support units and strike teams. 



#10
Idlem

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Yeah, my normal Tau opponent loves his Markerlights (denying cover) and submunition rounds against my poor guardsmen. Chimeras have helped me quite a bit in terms of protecting my squads long enough and are great fire support. I love my Chimeras though, so I will advocate the heck out of them. Guard can always use more Chimeras...

 

The change to Jink has really helped me out with Hammerheads though. It's now a decision whether you want a save against a lascannon or to fire at full BS, whereas before my opponent just gleefully enjoyed his free cover save. Make sure if he takes Hammerheads to always keep him in a position where he's gotta make that choice. Leaving him alone guarantees he'll take out something important with them each round. (Also, with a jink he can't fire that silly submunition!)

 

Your best bet is to take things that have an anti-tank/MC focus for this next round. Your squads and maybe the Eradicator can take down the Markerlights (as quickly as possible) while your new units (Exterminator, HWTs, Demolisher, Wyvern) focus on his big guns, which you know he's gonna bring. Also, bring Chimeras


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To the darkness I bring fire. To the ignorant I bring faith. Those who welcome these gifts may live, but I will visit naught but death and eternal damnation on those who refuse them.


#11
Kontakt

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Well the battle sounds like it went all wrong for the Tau Empire player. First of all I don't know what Shadowsun was doing so close to your army unsupported. She needs to be at a safe distance at all times. Sure the Erradicator tank is a threat, but that threat has to be dealt with caution. 

 

If your opponent brings a Riptide, you really need to look out, unless he makes blunders like he did this time. The Riptide can take a punch, and give one back with no mercy. But the Riptide in general needs markerlight support. 

Another potential up comer is a Hammerhead to knock out your tanks. With submunition upgrade it can be a huge threat to your infantry too. Worst part is that he can include two of them in 250 pts. 

 

Also do remember that Tau Empire get stronger and stronger once you increase the points of the game. This due to that they can start getting better synergy between their support units and strike teams. 

Don't forget, guard become stronger with the increase in points as well. And with the new wyverns and such good tanks, my money isn't on the tau. It will come down more to player skill and where the players spent their points.



#12
Emperors Immortals

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Very glad for all the responses guys :)

So the next game will happen over the next 2 weeks (due to Fireworks Day in the USA[is that ibdependane day?]) And ill be facing Tyranids.

I've got to use my first list and another 250 points for my army, so 750pts total.

Would I be better off with 1 wyvern and demmolisher OR 3 wyverns and then either some DS scions or an astropath, standard and extra stuffs? The next armies ill face re SM, AM and new dex Irks.

Also I need tips for my taurox vets, I don't know how to use them apart from CSS guard unit and a fast vehicle to secure objectives/ run distraction.

Thanks for tips and support do far!

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#13
Idlem

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Nid's are a different game from Tau. They're gonna be all nom-nom-noming your face. Wyvern is going utterly destroy cheap blobs, and in a pinch, be good at helping knock a few wounds off a MC since it can get rerolls, and Nid's will have MCs so be prepared. Demolisher is going to be a great asset against anything T5 and below, as it will simply wipe out whatever is under the blast marker. Keep the demolisher on gaunts, warriors and anything else it might insta-kill. Anything above t6 will be a waste of its blast unless it has no other target. Keep your troopers ready to screen charges, don't send the demolisher in charging alone with it's 24" gun against nids. 

 

The Taurox vets I assume are melta, and the Taurox needs to be able to support them in terms of fire. Those melta vets are going to be your anti-t6 critters. They're going to go where the Tyrant/Distraction Carnifix are. Keep high strength shots from Melta/Plasma at the MCs, and use the autocannons on the Taurox to support the vets. The Autocannon has the better range, so it'll be softening up the big critters right before they get ready to charge melta. You'll probably only get one round of shooting with vets before they're charged, so make it count. 

 

Just use the troopers to break charges against your key figures, the tanks and melta vets. They're there to die and take the nid's charge for the Emperor, so use their sacrifice wisely. If you keep that Eradicator, try to use it against the MCs. The multiple blasts mean they have a greater change to inflict multiple wounds, where the Demolisher only has its one shot.

 

Good luck!


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To the darkness I bring fire. To the ignorant I bring faith. Those who welcome these gifts may live, but I will visit naught but death and eternal damnation on those who refuse them.


#14
Emperors Immortals

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The idea of a swarm on Tyranids rushing at me to eat my face has made me think I need to stand back and allow at least another round of shooting in then last time. With that in mind, I thought about adding the following instead of the Demolisher (which will be the next add);

1. Naked Infantry squad
2. Special weapons squad with 2 flamers and a demo charge
3. 2 Wyverns

Basically I thought I could form 2 infantry squads, one of 20 with flamers and one of 10. Using the 10 strong group as a wrap-around for my Russ squadron I can then use the 20 strong unit to screen a special weapons squad with 2 flamers (for anti horde work) and a demo charge for the odd MC that will charge me, with the Wyverns throwing out 8 frag strength 3" pies of horde death.

The melta vets in the taurox would basically do what you suggested, Ldelm.

I dont have experience at this point level, but think this would be enough firepower to blunt most tyranid waves to teh point I can break them. Im a bit worried about flankers and very tough MC but I think that CC will be the heart of his plan, and I think it can make enough shots to counter it. Just not sure exactly how to take advantage of it beyond these ideas.

Edited by emperors immortals, 01 July 2014 - 01:35 PM.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#15
Emperors Immortals

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Theres also this list, assuming 20 are enough bodies for this plan;


CCS with Power sword for CC (mostly fluff reasons) and meltabombs

IP with special weapons squad w/ 2x flamers and one demo charge (can take the taurox if a good opportunity is there)

Vets with 3 meltagun and a taurox

Leman Russ Eradicator and
Leman Russ Demolitior


But I cant decide on which aspects I like most - the extra destruction a demolisher will bring or the troops boosting Wyvern tanks.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#16
Idlem

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My only hesitation to say to include a SWT with a demolition charge is that it is only 8" and can scatter. It can't instagib the MC's so it's a pretty big risk to make for the payout of 1 wound on a MC. If you're throwing it at a swarm, that's another matter, but for one model above T6 it's not worth it point wise.

 

If you're set on using the SWT only as a card against MC's, I would just invest the points of a SWT into putting flamers in your normal squads, especially if you're gonna blob guard them (2 d3 wounds on being charged!). SWTs are there to give more shots in case you have an outbreak of exploding plasma or saturate more Melta spam, giving them flamers and a demo charge works only if you're planning to front line 'em and expect them to die out quick. Otherwise they'll be standing around waiting for the squads ahead of them to die, then die themselves for their one shot items. (Flamers rarely get more than one chance to fire against nids).

 

Also, plan out your orders before you move anything. The PCS can make that blob awesome with FRFSRF against the swarmy xenos. Forwards for the Emprah, will let you shoot with a line, and maybe run just out of charge range for one more volley before they catch up. (They never say you HAVE to run forward...). The CCS needs to hang out with vets and the big guns for Bring it Down!, which will be the game changer you need against some of the MCs.


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To the darkness I bring fire. To the ignorant I bring faith. Those who welcome these gifts may live, but I will visit naught but death and eternal damnation on those who refuse them.


#17
WarriorFish

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Agreed, SWS are better left to higher point games I think where you are more likely to have the points to spare. At lower points you need to be efficient.


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Painting Oaths Completed:
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#18
Emperors Immortals

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You are both totally right, those guys are the cost of a wyvern, which would be infinatly more useful.

Looking at the points again, I could get 2 Medusa seige cannons for 150pts. Seems a T7 W4 model with a S10 AP2 ordnance large blast for 75 pts is a bargain - so is there a downside to choosing these over the Demolisher?

Anyway at that point id not really need the wyvern, so I could get an aegis for the meatsacks or just pack in 2 thudd guns. That would give me a metric tonne of pie plates at this level, but would I be vulnerable to anything that lived?

Im also wary of those flanking genestealers, ive faced Nids once with my BA and those guys just swept through my whole backfield it was pretty demoralising lol.

Continued thanks for all the input guys, since this is VASSAL im free to take FW and those gun carriages/platforms just look like amazing value. I need help lol.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#19
WarriorFish

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Infantry escorts will protect your flanks, especially with flamers :) Medusas are great, their cannon is nice but generally I think the mobility and resilience granted by the Demolisher is more versatile so it depends on your list. If you've a sizeable force holding your deployment zone/objectives then the gun platforms are much more viable.


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Painting Oaths Completed:
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#20
Emperors Immortals

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It was cold, bones ached and words froze on the tongue. All we could feel was The Fear. Commander Pieters was barking even more orders at us then usual, even for him. We knew it was bad.

 

Ladies and Gentlemen of the Emperors Finest, I present to you the results of my third ever battle as Astra Militarum (henceforth named "The Guard") and second in an escalation tournament held over VASSAL.

 

In addition to my 500pts list, I also took the following 250pts extension;

 

Aegis Defence Line

Primaris Psyker

Infantry Squad

Medusa Gun Carriage

 

 

My opponent today was a thoroughly lovely and utterly villainous Tyranid FMC player.  He was ruthless, here is his list;

 

 

 

HQ (230pts)
Hive Tyrant (230pts)
Shadow in the Warp, Synapse Creature
Powers of the Hive Mind, Psyker (Mastery Level 2) (Psyker), Twin-linked Devourer with Brainleech Worms, Twin-linked Devourer with Brainleech Worms, Wings 
 
Troops (90pts)
 
Ripper Swarm Brood 
3x Ripper Swarm 
Fearless, Instinctive Behaviour - Feed, Swarms
3x Deep Strike
 
Ripper Swarm Brood 
3x Ripper Swarm 
Fearless, Instinctive Behaviour - Feed, Swarms
3x Deep Strike 
 
Fast Attack (280pts)
 
Harpy (140pts)
Fearless, Instinctive Behaviour - Hunt, Living Bomb, Sonic Screech, Spore Burst
Twin-linked Heavy Venomcannon 
 
Harpy (140pts) 
Fearless, Instinctive Behaviour - Hunt, Living Bomb, Sonic Screech, Spore Burst
Twin-linked Heavy Venomcannon 
 
Heavy Support (150pts)
 
Carnifex Brood (150pts) 
Carnifex (150pts)
Fearless, Instinctive Behaviour - Feed, Living Battering Ram
Twin-linked Devourer with Brainleech Worms, Twin-linked Devourer with Brainleech Worms
 
 
First thing I noticed was that amongst teh swooping FMC's the only thing I could hit with my templates was the damn Carnifex; which promptly survived the Russ and the Medusa shell. I foolishly sent my Taurox mounted Vets up the flank to capture his Objective Marker instead of staying in the backfield and waiting to shoot along with teh combined Infantry squad I sent to back it up. The only excuse I have for this is adrenaline, this was the 4th attempt to have this game due to July4th and other stuff and I simply didnt think.
 
Heres a pic of the end of turn 3;
 
 
0O2sP0a.jpg
 
 
 
The game ended with me conceding due to a Ripper Swarm attacking my leg (kids dinner time) in the next turn. He flew over my infantry, releasing the spores. I killed one of the Harpies and the Carnifex, and all the Rippers in the same turn. I think with my vets and combined squad in place, I could have done a lot more damage. That was my big mistake.
 
Next week I add another 250 points, and so far the only thing I can think of for sure is a quadgun on the Aegis, any and all help or suggestions are totally welcome and needed :D
 
Anyway, Ill be adding a game every week and hopefully charting the growth of a part-time general who always wanted a Guard Army but just added to his CSM instead.
 
 
Glory to the Emperor, Death to His enemies!!!
 
The battle cry was familiar, and welcome. We had survived. We lucky few had survived and would fight again. Only thanks to Cmdr. Pieters would we get home, and there in the Officers Mess would we toast the dead and the fallen with the rations they had left in there stead. Our lives are in his hand, and we will follow him into Hell many times more before my tale is done.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#21
librisrouge

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Three infantry squads with grenade launchers and autocannons. Blow him from the sky.

"Frak this, for my faith is a shield proof against your blandishments."
-Book of Cain - Chapter IV, Verse XXI

"I think you really need to be a guard player in order to have that kind of attitude about casualties. My forces were killed to a man for slight strategic gain? All I heard was a buzzing noise until that part about strategic gain."
-Ailarian, Hand of the Kind XXXI

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#22
David Ravel

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You could add a Leman Russ Exterminator also. I'm beggining to use those buggers more and more. They're dirt cheap, offer front AV14, and can rip easily through light transport and some MC (Harpy have 4+). The fact that they are twinlinked can even give you a good chance of hurting FMC or light armoured flyers. On infantry, it's still 4 autocannon shot + 3 heavy bolter shot. 



#23
Emperors Immortals

Emperors Immortals

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"They refuses to acknowledge all requests for verification, Sir"

Pieters sighed, it could mean a raid by the hellish Dark Eldar, or it could mean those damned Catachans had gone silent again.

"Inform the men, we intercept in 8 hours".

In his experience, there was never any reason to assume the best.



Just been informed I will be playing a Grey Knights player, its an added 250 pts. Im thinking extra psychic stuff will be redundant, and i can use more plasma/melta. Probably more bodies too.

Any thoughts? Will autocannons be effective? I suppose there will be a few rhinos.

Thanks again guys, also any tips on my creative writing attempts so far is appreciated.

:D

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark. 


#24
librisrouge

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Part of me still says three infantry squads. You can force him to roll a ton of armor saves and any cover will give you an edge in protracted firefights. I know that armor might seem the way to go but the local meta's ability to roll Rends has biased me when fighting GK.

"Frak this, for my faith is a shield proof against your blandishments."
-Book of Cain - Chapter IV, Verse XXI

"I think you really need to be a guard player in order to have that kind of attitude about casualties. My forces were killed to a man for slight strategic gain? All I heard was a buzzing noise until that part about strategic gain."
-Ailarian, Hand of the Kind XXXI

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#25
Emperors Immortals

Emperors Immortals

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Well, I could get three squads and another medusa carriage for 250.

What are the best times for an infintry charge? Like Astartes, IG have the same output either rapid fire or charging; unlike SM IG can't get all there bodies into combat.

I'm wondering if tying a GK squad would be possible with CC. Also unsure of how much power armour or Terminatirs hell bring, or AutoDreads.

Seems like volume of fire us the way to go, I agree with you there. Maybe another melta squad, since were nit doing maelstrom I can afford to sacrifice speed, which ties well with immobile gun carriages; which I'm in live with.

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forte @ Sep 26 2012, 03:55 AM<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Personally, I'd rather be captured by Night Lords than even fight against Slaanesh Marines. 



      Shh, no science. Only grim dark.